You don’t expect to be talking about love on a Thursday morning with a bigshot lawyer, but then again, love makes the world go round. At least, James Kamau’s world.
The chairman of DLA Piper Africa and managing partner of IKM Advocates is in love with love, and in here, there is no odour of desperation about him; he is not merely liked but well-liked. Out there, they call him Mr Good Vibes. How do I know? “Because the young people tell me so,” he says.
You’ve been practising law for a while now. Are you still excited by the profession?
I've been a lawyer for over 30 years, and every single day I wake up, I feel excited to make a difference, either for my clients, sometimes for the country, because of the kind of transactions I do. But very importantly, to make sure that I can keep the promise that I've made to the people I work with, that I will always try to do my best to bring in work, to do the best work, and to train them to become the best lawyers.
How has your perception of the law changed over the years?
When we were in law school, and when I started my career, I used to look at law as a matter of understanding what is in the statutes and what is in the case law. I've realised that law is about solving real human or business problems.
Who is the one person who comes to mind who made a significant difference in your life?
My late mum and my dad, now 87 years old. The difference they made is they showed the greatest love one can show to a child — I grew up feeling loved, and it has really impacted everything that I've done. I've felt that I'm generally someone who is loved. And that just makes it easier for you to go out there and face the world because you feel that you'll be liked, appreciated and respected.
The second thing that they did was that they paid a lot of attention to every aspect of my life, school and at home. And finally, they gave me responsibility from when I was young. Before I was 10, I’d sell in our shop in Kitale, and that level of responsibility has stayed with me. Some people grew up, but I was brought up [chuckles].
Great distinction, but what does that love look like in your life?
Love is about paying attention to people, being available and wanting to make sure that people are getting the best. Love is about looking at the interests of other people and not just what you benefit from those kinds of interactions.
Have you transferred the same kind of philosophy to your children, assuming you have some?
I have transferred those to my sons. Obviously, they will judge me in the same way that I can speak about my parents. I have been available to them, and during their birthdays, they say I am their example. I've done my best, but that is their story to tell.
It’s easy to signpost emotional scars for depth. For you, having grown up without any, where does your depth come from?
There are always things to be learned from both negativity and positivity. I'm also a strong believer that the challenges that one faces should not necessarily determine who they become. Those who have been given more, more is also required of them. I ask myself, 'What should I be doing differently?' This has helped me to empathise with people who have been brought up differently and help them overcome their challenges.
Are you always the odd one out talking about emotions, perhaps with your friend groups?
I've met a number of my friends who seem to have had kind of similar backgrounds to mine. But I've also had a significant number that have not, including some family members. My wife says even people who have been brought up in the same family could have different recollections and sometimes different experiences of what transpired.
What I like doing is telling people to apply logic to issues, to breathe and sometimes let things pass, because time itself is a great healer. And if you let the past and even sometimes the present affect every decision, you cannot move on.
Yet emotions always fight with logic.
A 100 percent. That’s why I think God gives you both. It’s not as obvious that one of the ways of resolving emotions is by applying logic. Because people then tend to think that it is okay to continue being emotional. Some of that logic could be: For how long will this continue to define me? Is this something that benefits or distracts? And as I have grown older, I have realised that rarely are things fatal. You make a mistake, and the truth is that one, people may not notice it. Two, people are more forgiving than we sometimes think.
James Kamau is the chairman of DLA Piper Africa and managing partner of IKM Advocates.
Photo credit: Sila Kiplagat | Nation Media Group
You seem and sound very composed. What part of your life do you not have a handle on?
That's a very interesting question. Let me think. [long pause]
Eddy, you can ask a difficult question. I sometimes find it difficult to understand the evil that can be done to people and the level of unreasonableness because I've seen people doing certain acts that I say I wish I could have some form of control, like when I see the theft and the wastage of public resources, I really feel that I wish there's something I could do about it, or magical powers to stop it.
And personally?
I thought you'd say that [chuckles]. The kind of things that people talk about when they ask those questions, you know, it could be things to do with anger, health or such things, but nothing comes to mind, so I shall continue to reflect on it.
Tell me something cool about yourself?
People say that I understand how to grow and maintain relationships. And that I have gravitas. Young people tell me I have good vibes [chuckles]. I assume it’s something nice.
It is. What’s a con about you?
I can be quite demanding. I believe that if there's something to be done, it has to be done. And sometimes I feel as if I demand a lot from the people I work with and from my family. Some say that because of the level of determination, sometimes I can be very stubborn. I have since changed, but in my younger years, I tended to believe that I could never apologise, but sometimes just offering an apology can save me and the other person hours, days and sometimes years of agony. I've come to accept it as part of what I should do when the time requires that to be done.
What do you hope your children remember about you when they are your age?
They say that as a father, you should make sure that if someone says to your children that they remind them a lot of their father, that is not an insult. That they will be very proud to be associated with their father and take it as a compliment.
What's your superpower, James?
Creating endearing relationships. Looking back, I've had really deep relationships, and those relationships count a lot, whether it is in the social circles or in business.
What is something your success hasn't fixed?
That feeling that every time you are at your happiest. I still feel that despite all the success, there are those times when I can feel, ‘Is there something more to this? Is this it?’ And I'm asking myself that question. ‘Should there be more excitement? More happiness and joy? Is there more?’
You actually pre-empted my next question, but what do you hope you'll regret the least when you look back on your life in 10 years' time?
Eddy, at some point last year, I realised that I could have done more for my junior colleagues, who are paid less and struggle to grow financially as a result. So I changed the bonus system here so that the retirement package is the same for everyone. I believe that those on low pay need the retirement package more than others.
The other thing that could be a regret is what I could have done to mentor more young people. And how much have I shared with people about important lessons of life, whether it is within the family or within the investments?
Eddy, I will do my best to reduce the impact by trying to pay attention to some of those matters.
What's a hobby that keeps you grounded?
Golf [chuckles]. I picked golf after Covid-19 because I had more time, yet I live on a golf course, and believe me, Eddy, I used to run around the golf course almost every day. And when I picked it, some people think I'm actually obsessed.
Every Saturday, I play with my friends, and every Sunday, I play golf with my firstborn son, who doesn't stay with me anymore, and it's our way of catching up. Golf makes you structured and tests you in a way not many other things can, but also reveals the true character of people, be it anger issues or integrity. People cheat a lot in golf [chuckles].
What's a hack that makes your weekends better?
I become more structured. I'll wake up in the morning, and I do functional body exercises every day, 20 to 30 minutes. And then, depending on what time I'm going to play golf, I visit my dad, who lives just 20 minutes away from me and spend an hour or two. And then I go play golf. Come back, watch a match or a movie with my wife, or play chess with my lastborn. You haven’t asked me what I used to do before I started playing golf…
I have a feeling you are about to tell me.
Yes, before that I used to read and practise French.
Really?
I actually got a diploma from Alliance Francaise just after Covid.
Where were you getting the time, because French is quite engaging?
You see, if you like something, you do it. I was also not playing golf then. I did it in the car, listening to RFI (Radio France International) in French. This surprises people a lot. I was attending physical classes before Covid, and I was always the oldest in the class, but I was quite surprised when the results came because I was either top or top three. I beat those young people, but more importantly, I can read good French. I can speak, and it has just opened a lot of doors.
Are you planning to do something with this French?
Africa is big in French, and I look after our Africa law operations, where we have about six francophone countries. It helps me communicate whenever I visit. It is for both social and professional engagements.
Were your Sundays as exciting?
My Sundays have not changed much. Sometimes we go to church. But the one thing that we have been successful in doing so far is to have lunch as a family, because two of my sons don’t stay with us. We have a lot of banter, and people have come to know this is our ritual at Muthaiga Golf Club, which I finish with a game with my firstborn son.
What did you think would matter more than it does now?
Interesting question. How important health is to everything that you do. It just enables you or disables you from doing the thing that you ought to do and enjoy life. And people are quite judgmental when they think that you're not keeping yourself healthy.
The second thing is how important relationships are. I thought that usually, you'll get your work, so long as you're good at what you do, you'll still be able to thrive. I’ve realised people actually want to work with people they like, so the relationships you have will partly determine how you progress in life.
Now that I have you here, give us some random lawyerly advice?
I think the easiest one is don't commit any crime [chuckles]. And then you'll ask me, how do I know that I'm committing a crime? And my answer would be, actually, everybody knows [chuckles].
But who will pay the lawyers when they need work?
Well, there are people who don't listen to advice. What powers a legal profession are actually just three things. The biggest one, believe it or not, is ego. People have big egos, so they're not prepared to let things pass. The second one is greed, because people want to take advantage of others, so they will not meet their contractual obligations and will thus get sued. The last one is just the level of unreasonableness that you find in people. And then dishonesty. And now, as we're talking, I've just realised, because people don't take advice. So if I give you this advice, and then when you're driving, you're told to turn left, and you turn right, you've given the lawyer some work [chuckles].
